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The Jesus MeetUp
"Forgiveness vs. Relationship"
Week #17
The Jesus MeetUp Forgiveness vs. Relationship Week #17
Forgiveness vs. relationship is quite a difficult topic and one many choose not to think upon for it dredges up unpleasant thoughts and feelings. It is common for our psychological denial capacities to kick in in order to facilitate our comfort level and attempt to maintain it. However, this is where the clinical condition called “depression” comes from. It is not a healthy state and is one that only compounds over time if not dealt with.
What does forgiveness as a verb mean?
Verb: The part of speech that expresses existence, action, or occurrence in most languages.
Forgive: intransitive verb: Someone means to pardon that which “exists” by action or occurrence past or present. To relent in being angry or in wishing to exact punishment for (an offense or fault). To cease to feel resentment against (an offender): pardon. To absolve from payment of as in “We choose to forgive all need for reparations.”
Note: “cease to feel resentment”… This is not to try and redefine the event as having never occurred as in to “forget” something that has happened.
Regarding mob reparations demanded: 144:5.19 “As we in justice forgive those who distress and injure us.” ~ Jesus
Are we supposed to “forgive and forget”?
forget: transitive verb
1a : to lose the remembrance of: be unable to think of or recall; I forget his name.
2 : to treat with inattention or disregard; forgot their old friends He's now a forgotten hero.
Depression is a result of stuck emotions when one does not get what they want/wanted.
Oftentimes, we do not know how to forgive and yet we have been told that we are to forgive – which may seem impossible. If you are struggling with depression look right here. If you do not know what to do then ASK Him for help. He will help you from within yourself. Depression (major depressive disorder) is a common and serious medical illness that negatively affects how you feel, the way you think and how you act. Depression causes feelings of sadness and/or a loss of interest in activities you once enjoyed. It can lead to a variety of emotional and physical problems and can decrease your ability to function at work and at home.
Jesus walked away from the Pharisees with strong words:
175:23-25 “And now I take leave of you. You have heard my message and have made your decision. Those who have believed my gospel are even now safe within the kingdom of God. To you who have chosen to reject the gift of God, I say that you will no more see me teaching in the temple. My work for you is done. Behold, I now go forth with my children, and your house is left to you desolate!” “O Jerusalem and the children of Abraham, you who have stoned the prophets and killed the teachers that were sent to you [Jesus remembered the past events], even now would I gather your children together as a hen gathers her chickens under her wings [He would forgive them], but you will not!” ~ Jesus
Jesus chose to pass by or to move on. Why?
137:3.4 Jesus arrived in Capernaum Monday night, but he did not go to his own home, where lived James and his mother; he went directly to the home of Zebedee.
150:7.4 The attitude of Jesus' family toward him had also tended to increase this unkind feeling of the citizenry.
154:6.5 It was just another of those instances in which his [Jesus’] earth family could not comprehend that he must be about his Father's business. And so Mary and his brothers were deeply hurt when, notwithstanding that he paused in his speaking to receive the message, instead of his rushing out to greet them, they heard his musical voice speak with increased volume: "Say to my mother and my brothers that they should have no fear for me. The Father who sent me into the world will not forsake me; neither shall any harm come upon my family. Bid them be of good courage and put their trust in the Father of the kingdom. But, after all, who is my mother and who are my brothers?" And stretching forth his hands toward all of his disciples assembled in the room, he said: "I have no mother; I have no brothers. Behold my mother and behold my brethren! For whosoever does the will of my Father who is in heaven, the same is my mother, my brother, and my sister." ~ Jesus
193:3.2 “Judas is no more with you because his love grew cold, and because he refused to trust you, his loyal brethren.” ~ Jesus
Regarding Matadormus: Jesus disallowed his being a part of the 70
and insomuch Jesus moved forward without him.
163:2.9 Jesus foresaw that Matadormus, with his riches, could not possibly become an ordained associate of men who had forsaken all for the gospel [Jesus accepted this reality regarding Matadormus]; at the same time, he saw that, without his riches, he would become the ultimate leader of all of them. But, like Jesus' own brethren, he never became great in the kingdom because he deprived himself of that intimate and personal association with the Master which might have been his experience had he been willing to do at this time the very thing which Jesus asked, and which, several years subsequently, he actually did.
Definition of wisdom.
: ability to discern inner qualities and relationships : insight
: good sense : judgment
: a wise attitude, belief, or course of action
Do you lock your front door at night? Why?
We all make choices everyday with regards to whom we will be in “relationship” with. These are called “judgments”. We choose which banker to trust, who will babysit our child/grandchild, which doctor is the very best or whom we allow into our homes. These are all upright, normal and wise decisions for our lives and for those we love.
61:1.3 Basic mammalian instincts began to be manifested in these primitive mammalian types. Mammals possess an immense survival advantage over all other forms of animal life in that they can: 61:1.5 2. Nourish, nurture, and protect their offspring with affectionate regard.>>>Even the earliest of mammals protect their offspring with affection. The more base animals may not. [The kind of judgment we are admonished NOT to do is that of judging someone’s spiritual standing before God. This judgment is for God alone to make as He lives inside every one of us.]
Indicators of dangerous and remorse-less people of which wisdom would
dictate to keep a distance from:
1. insincerity
2. one who dismisses hurts they caused
3. dishonesty
4. defends their abuses
5. blames you for their abuse or things not your fault [your ethnic race]
6. cares not to listen to you
7. mocks you
8. demonstrable lack of perspective
9. gossips about you with falsehoods to others
10. one who “virtue signals”
11. one who organizes a tribunal for your public ostracism
12. uses guilt to make you feel responsible.
[Cancel culture is a modern form of ostracism in which someone is thrust out of social or professional circles – whether it be online, on social media, or in person. Those who are subject to this ostracism are said to have been "canceled".]
Jesus remembers ‘spiritual strangers’. Jesus does not forget. Should we?
166:3.4 "But herein is the DANGER to all who would postpone their entrance into the kingdom while they continue to pursue the pleasures of immaturity and indulge the satisfactions of selfishness: Having refused to enter the kingdom as a spiritual experience, they may subsequently seek entrance thereto when the glory of the better way becomes revealed in the age to come. And when, therefore, those who spurned the kingdom when I came in the likeness of humanity seek to find an entrance when it is revealed in the likeness of divinity, then will I say to all such selfish ones: I know not whence you are. You had your chance to prepare for this heavenly citizenship, but you refused all such proffers of mercy; you rejected all invitations to come while the door was open. Now, to you who have refused salvation, the door is shut. This door is not open to those who would enter the kingdom for selfish glory. Salvation is not for those who are unwilling to pay the price of wholehearted dedication to doing my Father's will. When in spirit and soul you have turned your backs upon the Father's kingdom, it is useless in mind and body to stand before this door and knock, saying, 'Lord, open to us; we would also be great in the kingdom.’ Then will I declare that you are not of my fold. I will not receive you to be among those who have fought the good fight of faith and won the reward of unselfish service in the kingdom on earth. And when you say, 'Did we not eat and drink with you, and did you not teach in our streets?' then shall I again declare that you are spiritual strangers; that we were not fellow servants in the Father's ministry of mercy on earth; that I do not know you; and then shall the Judge of all the earth say to you: 'Depart from us, all you who have taken delight in the works of iniquity.’ ~ Jesus
How can we have the highly valued learning for growth called ‘experience’
if we cannot remember?
75:8.7 If this were a mechanistic universe, if the First Great Source and Center were only a force and not also a personality, if all creation were a vast aggregation of physical matter dominated by precise laws characterized by unvarying energy actions, then might perfection obtain, even despite the incompleteness of universe status. There would be no disagreement; there would be no friction. But in our evolving universe of relative perfection and imperfection we rejoice that disagreement and misunderstanding are possible, for thereby is evidenced the fact and the act of personality in the universe. And if our creation is an existence dominated by personality, then can you be assured of the possibilities of personality survival, advancement, and achievement; we can be confident of personality growth, experience, and adventure. What a glorious universe, in that it is personal and progressive, not merely mechanical or even passively perfect!
What is the greater experience:
to forget something or to remember something and each time we remember we apply loving forgiveness? If God remembers should we?
108:0.2 God cannot experiential-y know what he has never personally experienced. Therefore does the spirit of the Father descend from Paradise to participate with finite mortals in every bona fide experience of the ascending career.
111:2.2 The material mind of mortal man is the cosmic loom that carries the morontia fabrics on which the indwelling Thought Adjuster threads the spirit patterns of a universe character of enduring values and divine meanings — a surviving soul of ultimate destiny and unending career, a potential finaliter.
We are known as “the world of the cross” and our entire local universe remembers vividly.
20:6.6 The extraordinary and unusually cruel experience through which Jesus of Nazareth passed has caused Urantia to become locally known as "the world of the cross."
Does God forget what we have done or does He forgive in advance even as we then do that thing?
159:5.16 The Jews had heard of a God who would forgive repentant sinners and try to forget their misdeeds, but not until Jesus came, did men hear about a God who went in search of lost sheep, who took the initiative in looking for sinners, and who rejoiced when he found them willing to return to the Father's house.
>>>It is implied here that God does not ‘forgive and try to forget’. He is more. He goes in search of those who are in error with full recognition and full forgiveness. So should we if we are to become like Him!
If Jesus could not remember those who were killing Him on the cross
how impressed would we be with Him?
187:2.4 Before Jesus was put on his cross, the two brigands had already been placed on their crosses, all the while cursing and spitting upon their executioners. Jesus' only words, as they nailed him to the crossbeam, were, "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do." He could not have so mercifully and lovingly interceded for his executioners if such thoughts of affectionate devotion had not been the mainspring of all his life of unselfish service. The ideas, motives, and longings of a lifetime are openly revealed in a crisis. >>>This is active forgiveness.
188:5.6 The triumph of the death on the cross is all summed up in the spirit of Jesus' attitude toward those who assailed him. He made the cross an eternal symbol of the triumph of love over hate and the victory of truth over evil when he prayed, "Father, FORGIVE THEM, for they know not what they do." That devotion of love was contagious throughout a vast universe; the disciples caught it from their Master. The very first teacher of his gospel who was called upon to lay down his life in this service, said, as they stoned him to death, "Lay not this sin to their charge.">>>If Stephen could not remember to actively forgive do we think that our Revelators would have made such a mention of this event in Stephen’s life and death in our book?
Jesus is ‘ruthless with sin’ and He does not forget. He forgives!
159:3.9 Tell my children that I am not only tender of their feelings and patient with their frailties, but that I am also ruthless with sin and intolerant of iniquity. I am indeed meek and humble in the presence of my Father, but I am equally and relentlessly inexorable where there is deliberate evil-doing and sinful rebellion against the will of my Father in heaven.
Forgiveness: So Conditioned!
146:2.4 God's forgiveness in fact is not conditioned upon your forgiving your fellows, but in experience it is exactly so conditioned.
Maturity vs. Immaturity
PTSD = Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. Consider: Telling someone to “forget” when they have desperately tried to forget some incredibly devastating physical or emotional event with some quip like ‘just forgive and forget’ can actually bring even more harm to that person by driving them deeper into a sense of failure as if somehow they haven’t tried hard enough to forgive. Consider: the rape victim (male and female), the soldier living through bullets flying overhead or they themselves have been seriously injured. Perhaps these grievously injured souls have held their friend as they bled out and died, watched a child die or being taken away, watched a parent murdered and more. They have probably tried and tried but to no avail to “forget” due to the fact that the event was too traumatic to EVER “not remember”. If we don’t have the ability to really help someone with proper council for healing as Jesus might give then the best thing to do is to tell them you will pray for them and then possibly to actually pray WITH them. At the very least continue encouraging them to keep reading Jesus’ teachings in pursuit of their own healing with God.
It is God who actually does the healing from the inside out.
131:1.5 "When you are sick, it is the Most High who heals you. God is full of goodness toward all men; we have no friend like the Most High. His mercy fills all places and his goodness encompasses all souls. The Most High is changeless; and he is our helper in every time of need. Wherever you turn to pray, there is the face of the Most High and the open ear of our God. You may hide yourself from men, but not from God. God is not a great distance from us; he is omnipresent. God fills all places and lives in the heart of the man who fears his holy name. Creation is in the Creator and the Creator in his creation. We search for the Most High and then find him in our hearts.
You go in quest of a dear friend, and then you discover Him
within your soul.
Some questions to discuss:
1. If your child was harmed by someone [physically, emotionally] would you suggest they spend time with them? Why?
2. Should we forget a person is a danger to us or the ones we love using forgiveness as a reason? Why or why not?
3. If a business partner stole money from your shared business would you enter into business with them again? Why?
4. Is forgetting healthy? [Think in terms of the disease Alzheimers.] Why?
5. Why did God give us “memory”?
Now, at the close of our meeting is a good time to say as a loving group The Lord’s Prayer all together.
Please turn these sheets back in to save on paper/ink. Thank you for being here.
Write down any questions you may have and give them to your leader.
To remembering to lovingly forgive!
Next is Week #18 In Pursuit of Forgiveness
